Ted Lasso's Jamie Tartt Is Learning to Play Nice
It's hard to imagine Ted Lasso's Jamie Tartt as anything but a swaggering Mancunian, but according to actor Phil Dunster, the character almost had a Spanish accent.
"How Jamie Tartt came to be Jamie Tartt was that he was originally Dani Rojas—but not as we know him now because Cristo Fernandez is Dani Rojas," Dunster, who brings the football primadonna to life on screen, tells me over the phone. "They saw Cristo Fernandez and went, okay, we're going to make a character and we'll find a name for him." But before that decision was made, Dunster went into the audition for Jamie with a Spanish accent, per the casting call breakdown.
Let's just say the reaction was mixed.
"They were like, 'Cool, great, thanks for that. It's funny. It's not quite right. It's not quite Spanish,'" Dunster remembers, laughing. But eventually the team called him back, looking for someone to play Jamie with a regional accent. "So I just went for something that I knew. A lot of the big clubs have amazing academy programs and those players come from around the city that the football clubs are in. Manchester is obviously is a huge footballing city with Manchester City and Manchester United there—and I really like this accent because my agent is also from Manchester and my girlfriend's family is from Manchester. And I loved reading Jamie and seeing the swagger that he had. It reminded me of Liam Gallagher—it just feels like it's a good little nod to that."
The character of Jamie has come a long way from that early casting call. This season, fans have watched as he tries to become a better person, only to realize that his strength on the soccer field lies in being a bit of a jerk. Here, Dunster breaks down Jamie's transformation from season one, opens up about pressures on set, and shares the story behind that "Baby Shark" theme song.
Tell me about the reaction to the show. What does it mean to you to hear that you've been part of something that's been a real bright spot for people in the pandemic?
It's very difficult to summarize, particularly as someone who's never been a part of something that's been spoken about by the queen, Brené Brown. That's something that takes a little while to get your head around, for sure. But I think the show came out at a time where a lot of people needed guidance and they needed kindness, and they needed to see compassion in leadership, and that's what we see with Ted Lasso, right? It came out at a time when people couldn't have people inside their homes, they couldn't have friends and family with them. So, it was a show where every Friday night you could welcome the team into your home. And I think that by the sounds of it, it satiated the closeness and kindness that people needed.
Did you feel pressure going into season two?
Well no, not at all. It's got nothing to do with me. It's just all Jason [Sudeikis] and Joe [Kelly] and Brendan [Hunt], they're the ones who bear the brunt of it. We just sort of turn up and we're like, "Oh, this is a good script, we'll just do that then." I'm only sort of joking. We're very lucky in that we get to just get out of the way of their script.
But yeah, I think that there's responsibility now, because these characters don't just exist within us on set, they exist within the people who have grown to love them. And by the way, I get insight about Jamie Tartt, genuinely, from people online and people strangely reaching out, showing understanding of Jamie and his story. It's kind of wild that this whole thing kind of belongs to the audience just as much as it belongs to us. So yeah, there's responsibility, but it's also a treat. It's an absolute joy that people care half as much as we do.
The character of Jamie has grown so since season one. What has it been like to play that evolution?
It feels like a pretty logical progression from what we've seen in series one; he's sort of done all that hard work. He's learned all of the vocabulary that he needs to use. And now we see him living that and trying to put that into practice. And so for me as the actor, there's a really wonderful arc that Jamie goes on. It's an arc, but it's also not a linear one. Jamie, he's still himself; he's still an idiot and troubled and difficult and annoying and selfish at times.
And I think that is what the joy is. It's not simple. These people are real and Jamie's struggles are real and he's not, for want of a better phrase, a dick just because he's a dick. He's in pain and he's hurt and he's a child. All of us, as much as we like to think that we're evolved human beings. We're all still children deep down. And Jamie is a hurt child deep down. And one that was in need of a father figure, of a family. And I think it's a real joy, those moments when you get to feel like Jamie maybe found that a little bit.
Therapy plays such a large role in the plot this season. Will we see Jamie in the therapy room?
I think Jamie, he's trying to learn his lessons outside of the therapy room this season. But the therapy room becomes a real location of...there are going to be real juicy moments in that therapy room to come, not necessarily for Jamie, but for some of the characters this season.
Ted Lasso is many things, and I think at its worst, it's a show that is nice and shows that people can be kind and also funny. But I think at its best, it tries to tap into the deeper, darker things in us, the things that show us that we are scared and that we're vulnerable, and I think no more so than in that therapy room.
In the episode “The Signal,” Jamie realizes that some of his talent as a player comes from the fact that he’s an asshole. What did you think about that?
Speaking of therapy, my therapist actually says everybody has an emotional shadow. And a lot of that stuff in the shadow is bad, it's the things we don't like about ourselves, the things that are not necessarily charitable or kind. But there is stuff within that that makes us, us. And I think that it's important for us to know what the shadow is and know who that shadow is, so that we can bring that into the light and understand and use it for the bettering of ourselves and those around us. Because if we don't shine light on that, then it's just going to stay in the dark and it can hinder us, which is, a sort of indulgent way of saying that, yes Jamie's becoming better, but Jamie's still an asshole.
And so it's about telling that line. And I think that's joyful, what a funny character quirk that his power is in his douchebaggery. And I think that that's so fun and silly, but also again, I think we all have those friends right? Where we're like, yeah he's an asshole but he's my asshole. Not my asshole, but you know.
What do you think of the fact that it's Roy who helps him realize that
Yeah his arch-nemesis. That's the old dog teaching new tricks, and I think that it's no coincidence that it is an alpha man that is teaching Jamie these things. That's another important thing of the show—even the people, like Roy Kent, who we deem to be strong and brave and brazen can turn around and say, "I see you and I witness you" in his own way. He's able to say, "I see what's going on deep down here, Jamie." And it's really drawn out of him but he cares enough...he gives enough of a shit to try and help Jamie become better. Now maybe that's for the good of the team, maybe not. I don't know what Roy Kent's intention was there, but I think that's the power of this wave of compassion, where Roy sees that Jamie's in a tough spot and in the Roy Kent way, tries to help him out a bit.
There’s been a trend on Twitter to liken players on AFC Richmond to real life Premier League players. What do you think of those comparisons?
I think everybody who made the show and is on the show loves football. And so there are many little nods to different players. We've even watched when players come out for the anthem at the start of the game. It's interesting which players go where in that lineup, there's a hierarchy to that. And so hopefully those looking for sort of deep cuts like that, see them—if you know, you know. From what I've seen online, people have responded to Roy Kent being like Roy Keane and Jamie Tartt...there's lots of footballers that I've taken on. There's a lot of prima donnas out there. So there's a bit of Neymar, there's a bit of Jack Grealish—a few people have likened the haircut that Jamie's got this season, rightly or wrongly to, Jack Grealish—there's a bit of Olivier Giroud, bless his cotton socks. I'm sure there's lots of different coaches that make up Ted Lasso as well.
Last question: Does "Jamie Tartt do-doo doo-doo-doo" ever get stuck in your head?
Yes, it always gets stuck in my head, I went back to see my nieces, and my family greeted me with that song, which was terrifying. That song came about because...I have a rubbish memory, but I believe there was a conversation between myself and Joe Kelly or maybe Brendan Hunt, or all of the above. They were looking for a song and asked if I had any in mind. And it's quite a fun little game that we have on set: what would your song be? What would your chant be? I think that the syllables work and it's very catchy. And I thought this feels like there's a good sort of transatlantic understanding here.
It fit quite well, but obviously I thought that we would never be able to get the rights for it, but then, it's Apple and they're good with music. So I was pretty stunned during post production, during the ADR stuff when we were finalizing all of the sound. I remember asking "So what song are they using instead?" And they were like, "Oh no, no, no, they're using it. They got it." I was overjoyed to hear that, but also terrified of all the angry parents that were going to be coming for me after their child had started singing that song again.
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